Discuss how demonic possession and other supernatural things are possible.or not

Be very very careful Davey. You might mistake it for one of the Duck Dynasty and then before it's too late you hear banjo music and ......

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Originally posted by Davey45

I'm going on an expedition to find the Skunk Ape. It's like the Sasquatch/Yetti of the Everglades.

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Originally posted by Bangledeshica

All those karate chops were for naught...

You should chop a sasquatch.

My biggest problem is with all of those gawd awful huge bugs in the woods, I grew up on the farm and spent lots of time in the barn, but I didn't live in one. At least in the woods pertaining to Sasquatch, he, she, it, I could see whatever it is coming.

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Originally posted by NightCruiser

I am not sure why I had this experience LIA. Maybe some are picked out so they can tell others?. I was under 9 years old. I take the part back about not seeing a white light. I don't remember going to a white light. On the way back to my body, I looked back and saw a moon shaped white light. So I am figuring I was a white light in a protector, guardian? white light. I was roof top high( ranch style one story homes). I looked to my left and saw roof tops. I looked down and saw people had formed a complete circle around my slumped over lifeless body. I was looking through the glow of a white light. I had no human emotions about the scene. No feeling of attachment to the body. No sense of time. No--I want my mommy! thoughts. No pain. But when the light(me) hit my head it was like a blast of pain hit me.
Yea Eric, I did a lot of research on this subject since then

Did you even notice how your whole story completely changed and the two version aren't even remotely close to each other?

I just added more details that I was really hesitant to share with the Sasquatch crowd. I mean really, why share such an intimate thing with people who think everything Spiritual is a joke?. I am describing something that happened decades ago. A good many out of body experiences say they went toward a bright White light. The next thing I know, I was in a white light. I don't remember going toward anything. I didn't feel the need to reject or go toward the light. I didn't see God or Relatives like some experience either. Yea I turned and looked back and saw a moon shape light but the light was no shining like the Sun. The light, just was white. I really don't like heights. You would have thought being roof top high would have bothered me but it didn't. Just not the same thought process as being in the body, is what I experienced

The problem I have with Sasquatch is where are the bones of any Sasquatches?. They have to die sometime. You would think someone would find their graves if they buried each other

So... where's the bones of Gods then?

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Originally posted by F1098

Be very very careful Davey. You might mistake it for one of the Duck Dynasty and then before it's too late you hear banjo music and ......

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While I'm pretty sure the only human residents of the Everglades are Miccosukee (sp) Indians, I be adequately armed to defend against..banjo enthusiasts.

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Originally posted by NightCruiser

I just added more details that I was really hesitant to share with the Sasquatch crowd. I mean really, why share such an intimate thing with people who think everything Spiritual is a joke?

To be honest, I don't think everything spiritual is a joke, far from it. I have my own experiences and researches but, as I said before, can't make conclusions for sure about "spirits" and such. Spirituality isn't only that though as there are many more subjects to be discussed in that domain.
I just think that this thread isn't based and serious enough stuff to make it interesting for a constructive discussion. Sorry.

I've never said everything spiritual is a joke either. I agree that a lot of things are unexplainable, however just because we can't explain it, doesn't mean that its supernatural or spiritual. Yes, I don't believe in God, I think if god existed and there in fact is one true religion then he would have intervened by now to tell the other religions that they're doing it wrong. Its also important to realize that spirituality and supernatural aren't the same thing in my opinion. Could ghosts exist? Sure they could, but as of today there is not enough evidence to say they do.

As for seeing loved ones, or god, or something supernatural when you die...well I'm sorry but all those accounts have to be thrown out as tainted evidence. If you have a near death experience, then by definition you have to rule yourself out. Death implies that your body is dying, when your body dies, so does your brain, you can't expect things that you hear and see to be interpreted by the brain properly if its dying. Even people who are not that close to death, when short on oxygen can't trust what their brain tells them. Pilots flying too high without oxygen has reported euphoric sensations and felt like they were in no danger, but in reality were. Divers who have nitrogen build up in their blood, they experience a type of high and do irrational things like stay under longer than air allows them, and forget to do safety stops while accenting. These are examples of oxygen starvation, but certainly not near death experiences. In a near death experience, the brain is without oxygen much longer, so it stands to reason that signals the brain receives are much more mixed up than in my other 2 examples.

"High Five" to you SP. There is no such thing as god in reality. Just another human construct developed from our need for strength and guidance. Life/human survival is a bitch and humans need tools to get through it.

I have no problem with the notion of god. To each his own. Only when it is assumes political dimensions and is used as an instrument of power does it anger me.

Lastly, your avvy is driving me crazy. Is there any particular reason you chose 52 rpm ?

Spirituality have nothing to do with ghosts or religion in my opinion. It's also not a joke. The "proof" of ghosts etc that's out today IS a joke however. I myself believe in higher beings, not gods, especially God. Organized religion is just a scam for weak people in my opinion. But to each their own. But like SP said, when it comes to near death experiences it's all crap. It's just your brain dying and stuff you make up minutes, days, years after the fact.

God can't be a "he" as it's supposed to be omniscient and "perfect". So the closest thing to God that could exists is... everything. That's why some say we are part of "God". Does everything as a purpose, a goal, an agenda : I don't know but there is clearly no individual ruling the universe and able to clearly intervene.

There are other ways to experience out of body trip than near death experience. Meditation, lucid dreaming, trances or sometimes simple circumstances can lead to that too. Now the questions I'm still asking myself are :
- are those experiences real or just an hallucination/dream (some people report being able to go to places they never went or see people they know doing something that was verified when they asked them later though).
- if they are indeed "real", does that mean there is some kind of spirit in ourselves able to survive out of the body or is it still tied to it (meaning that when you die, it dies too).
To me, it's really hard to answer those with certitude because I'm pretty open minded but still cultivating doubt.

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Originally posted by F1098

"High Five" to you SP. There is no such thing as god in reality. Just another human construct developed from our need for strength and guidance. Life/human survival is a bitch and humans need tools to get through it.

I have no problem with the notion of god. To each his own. Only when it is assumes political dimensions and is used as an instrument of power does it anger me.

Lastly, your avvy is driving me crazy. Is there any particular reason you chose 52 rpm ?

I agree, I think if people need something to have faith in, then god probably isn't such a bad notion, however, when they start believing that god will get them through this tough time, or that they prayed to god to that something would happen, then I have a problem with it. The only thing that is going to get you through this world is you....you alone. If there is god, and he cares so much about us, then why the fuck hasn't he cured cancer, or MS...why does he let children get raped an murdered...why does he deny some people freedom? God is a crutch for people to afraid to handle the real world.

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Originally posted by omuh

There are other ways to experience out of body trip than near death experience. Meditation, lucid dreaming, trances or sometimes simple circumstances can lead to that too. Now the questions I'm still asking myself are :
- are those experiences real or just an hallucination/dream (some people report being able to go to places they never went or see people they know doing something that was verified when they asked them later though).
- if they are indeed "real", does that mean there is some kind of spirit in ourselves able to survive out of the body or is it still tied to it (meaning that when you die, it dies too).
To me, it's really hard to answer those with certitude because I'm pretty open minded but still cultivating doubt.

I used to meditate a lot as part of my on going therapy, and I still do sometimes when I'm feeling overwhelmed. I will agree that I can reach a state of total calm and serenity, but I wouldn't ever call it an out of body experience, as I'm very aware of some parts of my body...my breathing in particular. But other aspects, such as my spacial perspective (where my body is) are very obscure...meaning I don't really know where or what my body is doing. Having said all this...I've never witnessed anything spiritual or supernatural.

Well put Omuh

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Originally posted by omuh

God can't be a "he" as it's supposed to be omniscient and "perfect". So the closest thing to God that could exists is... everything. That's why some say we are part of "God". Does everything as a purpose, a goal, an agenda : I don't know but there is clearly no individual ruling the universe and able to clearly intervene.

There are other ways to experience out of body trip than near death experience. Meditation, lucid dreaming, trances or sometimes simple circumstances can lead to that too. Now the questions I'm still asking myself are :
- are those experiences real or just an hallucination/dream (some people report being able to go to places they never went or see people they know doing something that was verified when they asked them later though).
- if they are indeed "real", does that mean there is some kind of spirit in ourselves able to survive out of the body or is it still tied to it (meaning that when you die, it dies too).
To me, it's really hard to answer those with certitude because I'm pretty open minded but still cultivating doubt.

Scientist cannot explain where the explosive device that allegedly created the Universe came from. Scientist theorize that the Universe is expanding into nothingness/void. So in this "void" there was supposedly an explosive device, so powerful, that is created an infinite Universe? So if the Universe is expanding into nothing, then the explosive device had to be sitting in nothing. There was no Universe loaded with heat and energy to build an explosion. There was nothing.
Then you have to believe an inanimate object like the Universe had a desire to create life--for some odd reason. Since scientist now say the Universe spreads life through comets, asteroids etc. The Universe even stopped the contraction aspect with dark matter. The Universe created Gravity, atmospheres and magnetic fields to protect planets and inhabitants.
The above takes a lot of "Faith" imo
But anyway, you cannot get past the fact that Scientist do not know anything about this explosion device or where it came from or why it exploded when it did. What triggered the explosion? Maybe God? Why was the device loaded with "Matter"? Was it Nuclear?
The Bible says in the beginning there was a VOID
To be an Atheist takes a lot of faith. Faith that something came out of nothing for no reason whatsoever. I used to know this Atheist. Brilliant and successful. Toward the end of his life he said there must be a God, because there is no other explanation....

Why doesn't the quote button work all the time? Sugarpie, the Bible say over and over that Lucifer is God of the Earth. Lucifer is Gods most powerful and beautiful Angel. Lucifer aka Satan, became very vane and jealous that God created Humans. So he/it was kicked out of the Heavenly realm and sent to Earth where he tried to sabotage Gods creation and he did a good job of it as we can see. All part of Gods plan to give everyone a choice. But that choice led to death, destruction, disease etc

Isa.14

[12] How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

Lets take the story of Job. Looks to me like God created an adversary and made him God of the Earth. God the Creator of everything--including Angel Lucifer, wants us to choose him over the God of the Earth. No matter what bad things happen to us. Lucifer is here to turn as many of us as possible away from God. That is his purpose. God put Spirits in us so Satan could not win over death.
Here is part of the Job story so you can see the game. This is just the beginning of bad things that happened to Job. In the end, Jobs love for God never wavered:

Job.1

[6] Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.
[7] And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
[8] And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?
[9] Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?
[12] And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.
Job.2

[1] Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD.
[2] And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
[3] And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou moved me against him, to destroy him without cause.
[4] And Satan answered the LORD, and said, Skin for skin, yea, all that a man hath will he give for his life.
[6] And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, he is in thine hand; but save his life.
[7] So went Satan forth from the presence of the LORD, and smote Job with sore boils from the sole of his foot unto his crown.

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Originally posted by Sugarpie

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I used to meditate a lot as part of my on going therapy, and I still do sometimes when I'm feeling overwhelmed. I will agree that I can reach a state of total calm and serenity, but I wouldn't ever call it an out of body experience, as I'm very aware of some parts of my body...my breathing in particular. But other aspects, such as my spacial perspective (where my body is) are very obscure...meaning I don't really know where or what my body is doing. Having said all this...I've never witnessed anything spiritual or supernatural.

Meditation is a tool. So you can use it for different purposes as relaxation like you did or to access other states of mind. So it really depends what you're looking for and what you do when meditating.

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Scientist cannot explain where the explosive device that allegedly created the Universe came from. Scientist theorize that the Universe is expanding into nothingness/void. So in this "void" there was supposedly an explosive device, so powerful, that is created an infinite Universe?

Pretty sure that's not what the big band theory says... According to it, there was no "explosion" per say but a rapid expansion of the universe (which is still expanding). Basically, at the beginning everything was at one single point (you can call that god if you want ^^).

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Then you have to believe an inanimate object like the Universe had a desire to create life--for some odd reason. Since scientist now say the Universe spreads life through comets, asteroids etc. The Universe even stopped the contraction aspect with dark matter. The Universe created Gravity, atmospheres and magnetic fields to protect planets and inhabitants.

The universe as no will. Things happened with billion of billion of possibilities. So out of them, some condition made some event (like life) possible.

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o be an Atheist takes a lot of faith. Faith that something came out of nothing for no reason whatsoever.

You know you can be atheist and believe the big bang theory isn't true just like you can be religious and still think this theory is true. Because religion is about faith in something superior and having principle of life. The Bible is a tale meant to teach those principles juts like fairy tales are here to teach some morales to children. If you really think that the story in it is factual then I have bad news for you...

The devil was created by the church when people started getting away from religion. It's basically the same as fear driven politics.

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Originally posted by NightCruiser

Why doesn't the quote button work all the time? Sugarpie, the Bible say over and over that Lucifer is God of the Earth. Lucifer is Gods most powerful and beautiful Angel. Lucifer aka Satan, became very vane and jealous that God created Humans. So he/it was kicked out of the Heavenly realm and sent to Earth where he tried to sabotage Gods creation and he did a good job of it as we can see. All part of Gods plan to give everyone a choice. But that choice led to death, destruction, disease etc

So you're saying that children choose to be raped and murdered, that good people choose to get cancer, and society chooses to allow people like Adam Lanza to exist?