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Don't ask, don't tell

Starter: [Deleted] Posted: 14 years ago Views: 13.2K
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#4456696
Lvl 14
Quote:
Originally posted by Sugarpie

Give me an example of minority rights for gays.

On second thought...after reading your 3rd paragraph (my iPhone didn't load it at first) I'm done discussing this with you. I can't discuss something with someone so delusional as you that thinks a short haircut means you're gay.


it was just an example of things that might distinguish you as being different, not any sole thing meaning you are gay.... but again take soemthing out of context and ignore the issue, that is always what minorities do, next say I am a homophobe cause that is always the standard response of an unintelligent person....
#4456697
Lvl 59
Quote:
Originally posted by thegame14

you just keep proving my point over and over, by failing to address the real issue, not minority wants equal rights, they want equal rights of the majority while retaining their minority rights. And that is the height of hypocrisy. And it is not just gays it is every minority

Blacks, you want equal treatment, fine drop everyt program desigend to benefit your group, no more NAACP, no more wik, no more EBT, no more affirmative action, no more equal opportunity employment, no more Al Sharpton or that other idiot. Drop all of those and you will get equal treatment. all or nothing, no picking and choosing, no excuses

gays, you want equal treatment, drop the entire gay culture and anything that makes you distinguished as being gay. No more butch women, no short haircuts and tattoos. no more liz phair, no more parades, no more gay clubs, no more rainbow anything. No lisps, not over the top emotional you go girlfriends or finger snaps, nothing. You have to act like a straight person in ever facet of your life, except your own private bedroom, then you will get equal treatment. But it is all or nothing. you have to drop anything that would let anyone know you are gay, anything....

women, you want equal treatment fine, no maternity leave, no guys paying for drinks at bars, no guys paying for yoru meals, no flowers or candy on valentie's day, no talking about chivalry, and being treated like a princess. No more calling out of work cause you have a "migraine" or a "headache" cause you are having your period. Start working more dangerous jobs like construction, mining, etc. instead of teachers and secretaries... Drop every advantage you get for being of the female sex, then you will get equal treatment... Again, all or nothing, no picking and choosing, no excuses

spanish people, you want to come here and enjoy our jobs, school system and healthcare, fine, but you will learn english, never speak spanish, dont own any flag but an american one, dont have visuva or whatever those soccer horns are, dont talk about boriqua or anything related to your old country, dont send money back home and take it out of the american economy, and be here legally and pay your fair share of taxes, and then you will be treated equally.


Just when I thought your posts couldn't get any more ridiculous, you post this and totally blow me away. That post is full of the most stereotypical bullshit I've ever seen all in one place.

To cite just a few examples, WIC isn't a "black" program. It's available to all low-income women, infants and children in the US. I know white women who have been on it. Your insinuation is racist, to be honest. Women with short haircuts are not all gay. A majority of women with tattoos are not gay. And if you're going to denounce gay parades, I hope you also denounce St. Patrick's Day parades (it's religiously affiliated). And, I hope you realize that telling people they can't speak spanish EVER is basically dropping your pants and taking a big shit all over that little thing called the first amendment to the US constitution. I also hope you don't eat tacos, quesadillas, tortillas, chili, or anything else that happens to originate from another country - which, unfortunately for you, is just about every fucking thing you eat.

Basically, everything you've said is either factually wrong, racist, xenophobic or bigoted.

Diversity is a good thing, in all aspects of life. In fact, diversity is essential for life. You, apparently, abhor anything that doesn't conform to what YOU think is the "normal american" standard. First, nobody anointed you king of the US to set these normal standards. Second, what you're arguing here is ridiculous and antithetical to everything the founding fathers were fighting for. They were escaping a regime which punished non-conformity. They wanted people to be free to practice the religions of their choice, allow for views contrary to the "norm" to be held and advocated, and generally were distrustful of majority rule, which is why the US is a Federalist nation, and does not rule by majority. They specifically were wary of mob rule - the tyranny of the majority - which is exactly what you're arguing FOR.


And you never addressed the question as to why you're ignoring the Declaration of Independence's statement that "All men are created equal."

Apparently, in your world, straight, white, protestant(?), natural-born Americans are more equal than every other human on the planet, who might have been born somewhere else, have a different color skin, speak another language, or love people of the same gender.
#4456698
Lvl 14
again like I said at least 3 teams, these are examples, meant to illustrate, a point, but again you ignore the point. The point isnt if WIC is just for this minoritiy or is a short haircut is a gay person, that is just one example... but again you will ignore the overall point and just harp on stuff that I specifically said is just an example, and again use hatespeak like racist.

The main point for at least the 4th or 5th time, is do you want equal rights, or preferential rights? If you want to be treated equal act equal and give up your minority rights and cultures, but you will not do that nor will you address that, cause you will not address the main point but focus on the little stuff, cause you dont have a real intelligent argument at all....
#4456699
Lvl 14
fine again that is the point, if we are all equal eliminate all programs meant to help minorities. We will all be equal, we all pay the same taxe rate, no programs for the poor or monority. no Wic, no EBT, no diversity, no equal employment, no affirmative action, all those things make us unequal by providing benefits for minorities. Eliminate all benefits and things the make your not equal and you will get equal treatment, but that isnt what you want, you want preferential treatment. And that is the main issue, for the 6th time, but you want address it.

You will continue to use stupid small examples and use hatespeech, which by the way is one of the things that gays are the most against.....
#4456700
Lvl 14
I myself couldnt care less if they were gay, straight or bisexual. Just as long as they serve with pride and do what needs to be done when called upon. There is no way in hell anyone can believe that in the past every person that stood out or gave their life for another in the heat of battle was only straight.
#4456701
Lvl 14
Quote:
Originally posted by EricLindros

...

Just when I thought your posts couldn't get any more ridiculous, you post this and totally blow me away. That post is full of the most stereotypical bullshit I've ever seen all in one place.

To cite just a few examples, WIC isn't a "black" program. It's available to all low-income women, infants and children in the US. I know white women who have been on it. Your insinuation is racist, to be honest. Women with short haircuts are not all gay. A majority of women with tattoos are not gay. And if you're going to denounce gay parades, I hope you also denounce St. Patrick's Day parades (it's religiously affiliated). And, I hope you realize that telling people they can't speak spanish EVER is basically dropping your pants and taking a big shit all over that little thing called the first amendment to the US constitution. I also hope you don't eat tacos, quesadillas, tortillas, chili, or anything else that happens to originate from another country - which, unfortunately for you, is just about every fucking thing you eat.

Basically, everything you've said is either factually wrong, racist, xenophobic or bigoted.

Diversity is a good thing, in all aspects of life. In fact, diversity is essential for life. You, apparently, abhor anything that doesn't conform to what YOU think is the "normal american" standard. First, nobody anointed you king of the US to set these normal standards. Second, what you're arguing here is ridiculous and antithetical to everything the founding fathers were fighting for. They were escaping a regime which punished non-conformity. They wanted people to be free to practice the religions of their choice, allow for views contrary to the "norm" to be held and advocated, and generally were distrustful of majority rule, which is why the US is a Federalist nation, and does not rule by majority. They specifically were wary of mob rule - the tyranny of the majority - which is exactly what you're arguing FOR.


And you never addressed the question as to why you're ignoring the Declaration of Independence's statement that "All men are created equal."

Apparently, in your world, straight, white, protestant(?), natural-born Americans are more equal than every other human on the planet, who might have been born somewhere else, have a different color skin, speak another language, or love people of the same gender.


you again are still doing what I repeatedly told you not to, and you still ignore the main point. Do you want 100% equal treatment or preferencial?

Not WIC isnt just for minorities, but the Majority of people on it are minoties, so it is geared for them, I would eliminate ST patrick's day parade and have Amrican Day parade, as we are all americans, not all women with short hair are gay, but many gay women cut their hair short or get tattoos to outwardly show they are different then most women, which is their way of telling the world they are gay, again not all but many. And all this has nothing to do wiht the point, but against for the 7th time you will ignore it, because it will prove you to be a hypocrite.

Would you give up every right/advantage of being a minority for equal rights, that is the arguement, none of this other small stuff that you keep bringing up, so stop bringing it up and stick to the main argument which you will ignore for the 7th time, cause you are a hypocrite
#4456702
Lvl 14
Quote:
Originally posted by plstellus

I myself couldnt care less if they were gay, straight or bisexual. Just as long as they serve with pride and do what needs to be done when called upon. There is no way in hell anyone can believe that in the past every person that stood out or gave their life for another in the heat of battle was only straight.


I agree 100%, I would let them serve as long as they serve as an American soldier, but I would not let them serve if they want to serve as a "GAY" american soldier. Act like any other soldier and no one would care, but the few ruin it for the many....
#4456703
Lvl 59
No, I would let everyone be who they want to be, act how they want to act, and do what they want to do, and I would STILL give them equal rights.



As for that "other small stuff" I keep bringing up, like the basic tenets the United States was founded upon, free speech, and facts, well, I'm sorry but I won't ignore them because they don't fit into your nonsensical view of the world.
#4456704
Lvl 14
so you prove it again and again, you want equal rights, AND minority rights, so you are in fact proving yourself to be a hypocrite. Thanks for clearing that up. You want to be treated equal act it, you want to be treated different act different, end of story....
#4456705
Lvl 6
14, You keep accusing EricLindros of avoiding your questions and your main points, however you have yet to answer his, mine, SugarPie's or anyone's questions. STOP BEING A HYPOCRITE.
#4456706
Lvl 59
Quote:
Originally posted by thegame14

so you prove it again and again, you want equal rights, AND minority rights, so you are in fact proving yourself to be a hypocrite. Thanks for clearing that up. You want to be treated equal act it, you want to be treated different act different, end of story....


You really aren't making any sense.

What you're saying is that the only way people should have equal rights is if they all look, act and speak the same.

That's NOT what equal rights means.
#4456707
Lvl 14
if you wanted equal rights shouldnt we have a campaign to increase awareness of straight people and have an affirmative action and National association for the advancement of white people and demand that mexico speak english.... wouldnt that be equal??? Of wait you wont even understand that anyway.......
#4456708
Lvl 59
Do you know why those things (NAACP, gay rights, ect) exist?


They exist to help those people achieve equal rights. Those organizations were created because people in those demographics were/are being discriminated against, and those organizations fought for equal rights, and to eliminate discrimination of the group they represent.


For example, if black people are not allowed to vote, they're not being given equal rights. So, the NAACP advocates on their behalf, raises awareness, and tries to change the status quo to give those people the same rights as white americans enjoy.

So, again, the purpose of those organizations is TO ELEVATE THE RIGHTS OF THOSE MINORITY GROUPS TO EQUAL STATUS WITH THE RIGHTS MAJORITY POPULATIONS ENJOY.

This isn't a hard concept.
#4456709
Lvl 14
so we need to elevate them even when they hold the highest office in the land??? Oh wait that doesnt make anysense at all, because only an idiot would believe that their true intention was equal rights, when their real intention is preferential rights.... but you woulldnt believe that.....
#4456710
Lvl 59
So, you're saying that because one black man is president, all blacks, gays and women are not discriminated against?

Yeah, that sounds reasonable.


since you think everyone already has equal rights, here's some homework for you:

What percentage of the 43 Presidents of the United States were black? What percentage have been women? What percentage have been hispanic?

What percentage of Congress is black? What percentage is female? What percentage hispanic? What percentage is gay?

What percentage of the CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are black? Are women? Hispanic? Gay?

What percentage of the prison population is black? What percentage of the population of death row is black?


For reference, 51.5% of the US population is female, 13% is black, and 16% is Hispanic.



(Hint: White men are overrepresented in all of the political and business areas, black men are overrepresented in prisons and especially on death row. Why do you think that might be?)
#4456711
Lvl 14
still ignoring the main point keep it up until someone dumb enough believes you..................
#4456712
Lvl 59
Ah, the ad hominem attack; the last refuge of a failed argument.


You're the one ignoring the issue.

Let me recap how this conversation has gone:

You: If you want to be equal, stop trying to associate with organizations that fight for your rights.

Me: Those organizations are trying to boost minority rights up to a level equal to those of the majority.

You: Minority groups don't need advocates for their rights, because a black man is president.

Me: A bunch of facts showing that racism and sexism are rampant in society.

You: Anyone who agrees with you is dumb.


I'm done with you. It's blatantly obvious to anyone who is capable of any level of critical thought that you're staking out a position that's essentially indefensible.


Out of curiosity, if a group, any group, IS being discriminated against, what do you suggest they do to fix the problem, since you obviously don't want them to exercise their free speech rights to try to rectify the problem?
#4456713
Lvl 12
Quote:
Originally posted by EricLindros

...

Just when I thought your posts couldn't get any more ridiculous, you post this and totally blow me away. That post is full of the most stereotypical bullshit I've ever seen all in one place.

To cite just a few examples, WIC isn't a "black" program. It's available to all low-income women, infants and children in the US. I know white women who have been on it. Your insinuation is racist, to be honest. Women with short haircuts are not all gay. A majority of women with tattoos are not gay. And if you're going to denounce gay parades, I hope you also denounce St. Patrick's Day parades (it's religiously affiliated). And, I hope you realize that telling people they can't speak spanish EVER is basically dropping your pants and taking a big shit all over that little thing called the first amendment to the US constitution. I also hope you don't eat tacos, quesadillas, tortillas, chili, or anything else that happens to originate from another country - which, unfortunately for you, is just about every fucking thing you eat.

Basically, everything you've said is either factually wrong, racist, xenophobic or bigoted.

Diversity is a good thing, in all aspects of life. In fact, diversity is essential for life. You, apparently, abhor anything that doesn't conform to what YOU think is the "normal american" standard. First, nobody anointed you king of the US to set these normal standards. Second, what you're arguing here is ridiculous and antithetical to everything the founding fathers were fighting for. They were escaping a regime which punished non-conformity. They wanted people to be free to practice the religions of their choice, allow for views contrary to the "norm" to be held and advocated, and generally were distrustful of majority rule, which is why the US is a Federalist nation, and does not rule by majority. They specifically were wary of mob rule - the tyranny of the majority - which is exactly what you're arguing FOR.


And you never addressed the question as to why you're ignoring the Declaration of Independence's statement that "All men are created equal."

Apparently, in your world, straight, white, protestant(?), natural-born Americans are more equal than every other human on the planet, who might have been born somewhere else, have a different color skin, speak another language, or love people of the same gender.


I have an issue with this.....

I thought chili came from Texas, otherwise, I agree completely.
#4456714
Lvl 12
Quote:
Originally posted by EricLindros

since you think everyone already has equal rights, here's some homework for you:

What percentage of the 43 Presidents of the United States were black? What percentage have been women? What percentage have been hispanic?

What percentage of Congress is black? What percentage is female? What percentage hispanic? What percentage is gay?



President - Black - 0%, Women - 0%, Hispanic - 0%

Congres 111th

Women- 17%
Black - 8%
Hispanic - 5%
Asian - 1.3%
Gay - who knows, because not all people like to admit that they're gay

Now I ask you ... what is the breakdown by race, gender, sexual orientation of people that actually decide to run for these offices? Then I'll let you know much they are discriminated against.

I am not saying there is no discrimination. Percentages of population are not the only factors to consider. For instance, can you tell me that since there are more women in the U.S., more women than men have the desire to run for political office? Or, since there are more black men than white men in prison, the only factor to consider is discrimination? What is the percentage of whites and blacks that decide to engage in criminal activity? You don't know? Well, we don't know the whole story.

In 2011, under the law, everyone does have equal rights (besides gay marriage I guess). Let's not act like we're in the early 1900's. That's my only beef with your post really.
#4456715
Lvl 7
If you're giving your life for your country, you shouldn't have to lie about what you are.
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