Abortion

Let me fix this for you.

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Originally posted by moss

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Your You're wrong AGAIN.
There is a absolute connection between abortion and commitment to each other& It's hard to believe you don't see it.
If the abortion happens....No support!
If the abortion doesn't happen and the couple doesn't live together, get married, or make a commitment together, then the man or woman (whoever doesn't have custody) pays support.
See how easy that was to connect where I went wrong?
Now my previous point is that if a man is forced to be financially responsible, just as the woman is financially responsible, then he should have an honored part of the decision to abort or not whether to be in a commitment with the woman.
This is mainly for the simple reason that it's a lifetime 18 years of financial responsibility to have children so the decision should be evenly shared.

You're wrong AGAIN.
Child support and abortion have nothing to do with each other. Child support and non marriage/commitment have something to do with each other.

Quote:

Originally posted by Lia

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I would never impose on anyone, if I had gotten myself into a mess I wouldn't want to drag anyone else in. If I ever was fortunate enough to get pregnant I wouldn't ever bother the father with any responsibilities toward the child. He could keep his money and live his life without interference from me.

I think a better way to explain myself, if I met a man who wouldn't try to dominate me, and could accept me as I am, not as he insists that I am to be. He would have to accept me as an individual who is a devoted teacher at a local College, and as a business owner where I teach Martial Arts to young people and mostly women who are there to learn self defense. Many of which have been battered in their lives, who one time had a spouse come there and was going to batter them in my Dojang, as my brothers would say "that dog wouldn't hunt". I have three older brothers so there isn't much you can say or do that I haven't seen or heard. According to my brothers I have always been a bitch so training in Tae Kwon Do came natural to me, and I have also trained in Judo and Kendo. I luv being around and teaching children, and I feel sorry for women who have been abused. I will do anything to help them. Do I think that there are any men out there who might accept me as I am, I doubt it seriously. If there are any jus say hi, and let me know....

Quote:

Originally posted by Lia

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Eric your comment bout a baby being a parasite is beneath you, go home and thank your Mom for not killing you before your birth. You may never say a prayer but I will say some for you. I am not going to say anything that could start a fight, I'll jus end it there.....

Um, no. I'm not sure why you got all offended at me calling a fetus a parasite, but that's basically what it is. You could also call it a tumor and also be mostly correct.

Either way, when a thing needs to physically take resources from the body of another to remain alive, that's not an equal-footing relationship. The rights of the supporting organism should trump the rights of an organism living off of it.

Nobody should be forced, against their will, to allow their body to be used as a vessel for another organism to grow.

Yeah, I don't think Eric meant it in the "look its a parasite, lets destroy it!" kinda way. I think it was his way of saying that mother and fetus could be looked at as a parasitic relationship.

Two degrees...

Quote:

Originally posted by Sugarpie

Let me fix this for you.
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You're wrong AGAIN.
Child support and abortion have nothing to do with each other. Child support and non marriage/commitment have something to do with each other.

Child support is still child support regardless if the parents are in a commited relationship or not. You can play games with words but....It's still child support!!
I should have know from the past that your ignorance to valid points or facts was too much for you to grasp.
Funny how you change things up but it's STILL the same thing. "Left for dead"

Quote:

Originally posted by moss

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Child support is still child support regardless if the parents are in a commited relationship or not. You can play games with words but....It's still child support!!
I should have know from the past that your ignorance to valid points or facts was too much for you to grasp.
Funny how you change things up but it's STILL the same thing. "Left for dead"

If you're in a committed relationship you don't pay child support. You as a couple pay for the child's various needs. If you're not in a relationship with that person then you pay your share via child support payments and the parent with custody pays theirs. Again...abortion has nothing to with whether or not these payments need to be made. I get that you're saying that if the pregnancy was terminated then neither parent would have a financial burden, but it isn't whether that child is born or not that dictates mandatory support payments, its whether or not the parents are a couple.

Quote:

Originally posted by Lia

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I would never impose on anyone, if I had gotten myself into a mess I wouldn't want to drag anyone else in. If I ever was fortunate enough to get pregnant I wouldn't ever bother the father with any responsibilities toward the child. He could keep his money and live his life without interference from me.

It's actually not a mess if thought out & done correctly. I would hope that both parents would look out for the childs best interest whether they are together or not.
I hope if you are in a good position that you are fortunate to have kids too.
The whole point was that if it was a mistake and wasn't thought out properly, the woman has the right to keep the child as the primary care giver. The father could get some visitations but will be forced to pay from the courts if SHE want's it. Even if the father doesn't want to be a part of raising the child SHE still decides weather to make him pay support or not.
It's really that simple!

Quote:

Originally posted by Sugarpie

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If you're in a committed relationship you don't pay child support. You as a couple pay for the child's various needs. If you're not in a relationship with that person then you pay your share via child support payments and the parent with custody pays theirs. Again...abortion has nothing to with whether or not these payments need to be made.

Again...It has everything to connect the two. The father will pay a percentage of his income if SHE decides that is what she wants. Yes, usually it happens if they are not living together.
There is no formula for how much it costs, If he wanted her to have an obortion instead of a child & SHE decides to have it anyway, He will pay child support based on how much he makes weather he wanted the child or not.
BTW....I am 99% against abortion.

Quote:

Originally posted by moss

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Again...It has everything to connect the two. The father will pay a percentage of his income if SHE decides that is what she wants. Yes, usually it happens if they are not living together.
There is no formula for how much it costs, If he wanted her to have an obortion instead of a child & SHE decides to have it anyway, He will pay child support based on how much he makes weather he wanted the child or not.

First of all...its not ALWAYS the man that pays child support. Second....boo fucking hoo, if you don't want a chance of getting some woman you're not in a relationship with pregnant, then take the steps to avoid it. Third, you seem to think that the person paying the support payments is the only one burdened with the financial responsibility of raising that child...this simply isn't true.

What's the problem? If you want a baby and the father doesn't then you pay for the upbringing. If you can't afford it, go halves in an abortion.

charming

And vice versa

Quote:

Originally posted by Poida

What's the problem? If you want a baby and the father doesn't then you pay for the upbringing. If you can't afford it, go halves in an abortion.

If the father doesn't want a baby, he don't take the risk to get one. Sure no contraception is 100% effective but then it's both the woman and man responsibility if she gets pregnant (because, you know, sperm isn't fire and forget, like your posts seem to be).

Mine is

Quote:

Originally posted by Sugarpie

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First of all...its not ALWAYS the man that pays child support. Second....boo fucking hoo, if you don't want a chance of getting some woman you're not in a relationship with pregnant, then take the steps to avoid it. Third, you seem to think that the person paying the support payments is the only one burdened with the financial responsibility of raising that child...this simply isn't true.

First of all......If you calm down & read the post I was talking about the mom having primary custody since he wanted her to have an abortion. In that scenario YES she has the right to force him to pay child support.
Second.....Please tell us what "steps to avoid it" are 100%.... None!! But it's cute the way you make it his responsibility. Your "boo hoo" emotions took over your logical thinking again.
Third.....I NEVER said or implied it was only his financial responsibility, NEVER!
What I said was ... The woman has all the control of abortion or not & she also has all the control of forcing the man to pay child support or not.
If women are fighting to keep their abortion rights, the father should have the same rights. The decision should be EQUAL as well as the financial responsibility. There is a lot more to it than a simple "O crap i'm pregnant, should I have an abortion or not"? It's not only 18 years, children are a lifetime commitment

Quote:

Originally posted by Sugarpie

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Second....boo fucking hoo, if you don't want a chance of getting some woman you're not in a relationship with pregnant, then take the steps to avoid it.

Funny, you sound exactly like people who are anti-abortion. So...if a woman wants an abortion, taking steps to avoid pregnancy are not important but if the man wants one, he shoulda used stronger condoms?

Also, what if a girlfriend lies about being on birth control? That scenario takes place more than most would like to admit. Now she's pregnant and demanding child support money even though the father was told "it's OK, I'm on the pill".

Interesting how people in the luckiest nations on earth argue about these things while poorest of the poor from the poorest nations on earth breed like flies and stick together in huge families looking out for one another. If this is where money has taken us I say do away with currency and bring back the love.

I'll take abortion arguments over living in abject squalor. To each his own. Enjoy your eyeball flies.

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Originally posted by Davey45

I'll take abortion arguments over living in abject squalor. To each his own. Enjoy your eyeball flies.

Same here, just thought I'd point that out and what's to say in such an advanced society as ours we can't live in comfort without currency?