Who's responsible for your sorry ass? : General > The Lounge

#4724372

Lvl 12

Deucie 12 years ago

Quote:
Originally posted by Sugarpie

I have a friend living in the US...she's 27 years old and was diagnosed with MS a little over 4 years ago. At the time of the diagnosis she didn't have any health insurance. So now, because her MS is a pre-existing condition, she doesn't qualify for any insurance. She used to qualify for a grant from the government that paid for a medication that is proven to slow down, and in some cases stop the growth of brain lesions...but recently she started making more money, and no longer qualifies for this grant. The medication that she used to take is $5000 per month (don't get me started on the drug companies). There is no way she can afford to pay for these meds, as the raise she got, just barely put her out of the bracket required for the grant.

The whole situation is appalling to me, in a few short months, I've witnessed my friend go from a person with MS that manages its very well, hardly ever having a bad day...to a woman who on average has 10 days a month in which she can barely walk. And why?? Because someone, or some group decided that if you make less than $65,000 a year you get a grant, but if you make more than $65,000 a year...you have to pay for the meds.

I work in healthcare and SP, MS is one of the hardest medical expenses to pay for or qualify for insurance. the medications are soo damn expensive and who's to say they work that well.. MS is a tough thing to deal with.. It suck and I have a patient who doesn't make $65,000 a year and still does not qualify.. wtf. I think it's ridiculous..

#4724373

Lvl 28

bustMall 12 years ago

Quote:
Originally posted by waywardson

so let me get this straight,,do you think the government should decide who lives and who dies? I paid into the medicare and Medicaid and social security system my entire working life. And I thank God it was there for me when I needed it.

Wayward, if it's me your directing that to, the answer is no. In fact, I've tried not to express an opinion either way. Just throwing out something for discussion that has been on my mind.

It's purely coincidental that I saw the video I posted above about the same time. If the video is factual, which it seemed to be, our budget is consumed by the payroll entitlements, interest and defense, meaning that every dollar of operational costs in the fed gov't is being borrowed.

What I'm struggling with in my own mind is where do we start drawing lines. There are some very tough decisions that need to be made, and I don't see any politicians with the stomach for making them.

My uncle just provided a perfect example for the conversation.

#4724374

Lvl 28

bustMall 12 years ago

Quote:
Originally posted by F1098

Are you sure that you and your political party of choice will not get mileage with the "Big government meddling in your personal affairs" argument. I can here the whining from here.

The whining of Tea Party clones and their imaginary "Death Squads" in the health plan can be heard. OR...is that what you are really asking for in your example of the retired pig of a human being ? How do you organize a policy that precludes the fuck ups yet allows for compassion.

...

After saying "I can't disagree with you", are you directing that at me? Or just making general commentary?

BTW, the vid was not posted in response to anything you wrote, just as a piece reletive to the conversation at hand.

#4724375

Lvl 12

Deucie 12 years ago

Quote:
Originally posted by scrog

...
I think smokers have already covered themselves with the billions they pay each year in tobacco taxes.

word

#4724376

Lvl 28

bustMall 12 years ago

I will say that I don't think the government should be responsible for the surgery cost to rebuild my face, just because I was stupid enough to pack my lip with snuff for the past 25 years.

#4724377

Lvl 19

F1098 12 years ago

But do they ? Iam not familiar with the tax rate in the UK, but here in California it is 87 cents per pack. Which means that a smoker of one pack a day pays $317.55 for each smoking year, or a mere $3175.50 each ten years x....oh, what is reasonable....a smoking life of 30 years or so ? OK $31,000+ tax revenue to the state.

GF is in premed and tells me that the minimum cost for a single lung removal is $80K. No hospital or chemo or anything else. Else meaning the effects of tobacco on the cardiac system etc. etc.

So how does the arithmatic work out in a country where there is no nationally subsidised health care system ( where other peeps..non smokers...would be paying for that $80K lung ?

I don't get it. But this is a big problem in terms of national policy and there is very little in the way of sanity involved in it. At any level. Personal responsibility is quite the joke, political policy looks no farther than the next elections and really....how does any government deal with human nature and elective pathologies in that situation ?

Quote:
Originally posted by scrog

...
I think smokers have already covered themselves with the billions they pay each year in tobacco taxes.

#4724378

Lvl 19

F1098 12 years ago

It certainly was there for you ! Think kindly of it the next time some fool starts ranting about how bad government is. I guess the bingo question for me is, what life style choices did you have that might have contributed to your health issues ?

Fair question, no ?

Quote:
Originally posted by waywardson

so let me get this straight,,do you think the government should decide who lives and who dies? I paid into the medicare and Medicaid and social security system my entire working life. And I thank God it was there for me when I needed it.

#4724379

[Deleted] 12 years ago

Quote:
Originally posted by bustMall

I will say that I don't think the government should be responsible for the surgery cost to rebuild my face, just because I was stupid enough to pack my lip with snuff for the past 25 years.

As long as the government allows smokes to be purchased legally and taxed I believe they are responsible for any initial surgery or treatment but if the person continues to smoke afterwards then they should be left to their own devices. If it was illegal and someone goes out of their way to get chop chop on the black market they don't deserve any benefits.

#4724380

Lvl 14

0ghash 12 years ago

Test

#4724381

Lvl 14

0ghash 12 years ago

This is really weird. When I try to reply with what I want to write I get a blank box posted. If this is readable then it is just that reply. That doesn't make sense?

#4724382

Lvl 28

bustMall 12 years ago

Quote:
Originally posted by scrog

...
As long as the government allows smokes to be purchased legally and taxed I believe they are responsible for any initial surgery or treatment but if the person continues to smoke afterwards then they should be left to their own devices. If it was illegal and someone goes out of their way to get chop chop on the black market they don't deserve any benefits.

I agree, for people in their 70's and up, for whom the health risks of tobacco were not yet known, and smoking was considering the "in" thing.

But as a guy in my mid-40's, who's been told all my life that tobacco will kill me..... I think I rolled the dice and should live, or die, with the results.

#4724383

Lvl 19

F1098 12 years ago

And if your family disagrees ?

Quote:
Originally posted by bustMall

...
I agree, for people in their 70's and up, for whom the health risks of tobacco were not yet known, and smoking was considering the "in" thing.

But as a guy in my mid-40's, who's been told all my life that tobacco will kill me..... I think I rolled the dice and should live, or die, with the results.

#4724384

Lvl 14

0ghash 12 years ago

F the tax is 5 pounds per packet of cigs in the UK.

#4724385

Lvl 28

bustMall 12 years ago

Quote:
Originally posted by F1098

And if your family disagrees ?

...

With my tobacco use, or that the gov't should pay to fix me?

#4724386

[Deleted] 12 years ago

OK I'm here looking at tits and ass and find myself in the middle of an Ayn Rand vs. Mao discussion. OK here's the deal - Open underwriting contracts for a voluntary 6 grand a year personal HSA. ANYTHING that one spends on health care per year comes from that, after the 6K is expended insurance kicks in. (In the US) at the age of Medicare anything left in the (cumulative) HSA rolls into an IRA, thus discouraging random HC spending and encouraging good health. PS: if you don't buy into the HSA you're fucked, get sick.

#4724387

Lvl 19

F1098 12 years ago

either !

Quote:
Originally posted by bustMall

...

With my tobacco use, or that the gov't should pay to fix me?

#4724388

Lvl 28

bustMall 12 years ago

Quote:
Originally posted by F1098

either !

...

Well, they accept the use for what it is. As deplorable as the habit is, I started it (not wanting to) to actually correct a problem. I have quit three times, and the problem returns. So, we have all accepted the risk.

As for the payment, I have raised my family to be of an independent mindset, that government should be as small as possible, and interject only where the constitution directs it (I'm a strict constitutionalist), and that we should be responsible for ourselves, rather than rely on government to care for us. I pretty sure they all, but one son, agree. I have been like that through poverty and plenty. It's how I got raised too.

#4724389

Lvl 19

F1098 12 years ago

Wow....I mean WOW ! Now that is a real sin tax, no ?

Quote:
Originally posted by 0ghash

F the tax is 5 pounds per packet of cigs in the UK.

#4724390

Lvl 17

Tyrannus 12 years ago

#4724391

[Deleted] 12 years ago

Quote:
Originally posted by FeFeHumHum

@ SP - yeah basically the only way she's going to be able to get coverage now is if she's on a group policy through an employer, in which case the policy recognizes no pre-existing conditions when it comes to acceptance for the policy. however even then they wouldn't cover anything related to the pre-existing condition for a year.

the whole system is ridiculous.

Yeah...she's self employed and currently working on a solution like that...which may or may not work out. But fingers crossed.

Quote:
Originally posted by EL
SP, I think Paddy's saying your friend should move to England!

Or Canada

Who's responsible for your sorry ass?

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