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Formula One

Starter: Watty Posted: 19 years ago Views: 15.0K
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#1864239
Lvl 22
well i reckon ya can both stop with the slanging match... both of ya have your own opinions on who is best, so the 2 of ya need to agree to disagree.

now on with the discussion without all the hostility thanks
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864240
Lvl 19
Quote:
Originally posted by mozaez

why does I have to shut up? you have been saying shit about alonso since he won the champinship and I didn't say anything until now, and now that there are some people suporting alonso, end of discussion? fuck you ascaris. If you don't want to quote me, don't do it, but I will say what I want about Alonso as you have been doing it for months


Yeah, and I've stopped that already, but you don't. See the pattern here slick?

You can love alonso as much as you want, but it stops right now. I think Kimi is the best, you can think what ever you want. I don't care.

Sorry watty, that peace of * is annoying me like hell. But don't worry, I won't let some fu*king n00b to ruin my day.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864241
Lvl 18
So, Kimi was in Cologne last week. That much seems to be fact. What seems less certain, is whether McLaren is really courting Nico Rosberg - or whether Kimi has already got a contract with Ferrari. Why would he be in Cologne, talking to Toyota, if the latter was the case?









More to the point: Why would Ferrari sign Raikkonen if Schumacher is apparently eager to race for another two years?
Not that Maranello has suddenly lost interest in the Flying Finn. Everybody knows he's the fastest guy in the world, barring perhaps Chuck Norris or Valentino Rossi.

No, just a joke.

But as Renault guru Pat Symonds said in the Silver Diamonds Paddock Club enclosure, after Montoya's Monza victory last year: "In Juan's hands, the McLaren is marginally faster than us. But in Raikkonen's hands, it is significantly faster."

Ferrari, rest assured, would sell Enzo's tombstone to tie the Kimster down.

King Creole

But they have a problem, and it goes by the name of King Creole.

Hey, an Elvis line there?

Yes, but so much more: At Maranello, Schumacher lords over Brits, Germans, South Africans, Italians, Japanese and even Indians, in the form of Tata, which supplies Ferrari soft-ware. They all deify the man.

But Saint Michael is, in fact, a Ferrari problem.

He might still be one of the three best drivers on earth, but a long-term solution he's not.

What Maranello needs now is heavy investment in the future.

And Michael is blocking it.

Which is par for the course, really.

In 1995, Schumacher vetoed David Coulthard as a potential Ferrari team mate for1996. And a move to McLaren in 1999 was turned down when it became clear that he would have to race Mika Hakkinen on equal terms.

Such an approach leaves no room to go head-to-head with Kimi Raikkonen in a bare-fisted fight.

Not at Ferrari. Not anywhere.

Second fiddle

Kimi, conversely, will not be prepared to play second fiddle as Herbert, Irvine and Barrichello have, and like Massa will have to do pretty soon.

Irvine, in fact, out-qualified Schumacher in their first race together.

Johnny Herbert was not too far off either, considering that he only did 12 laps in total at Interlagos, prior to 1995 quali - which he tackled in the T-car.

This after he had beaten Schumacher's best time in an off-the-line sprint, in his maiden outing in a Benetton.

Barrichello also came mightily close in his first run with Ferrari, losing out by 0.027 secs and outqualifying Schumacher in the duo's fourth race together, at Silverstone.

Massa also was just 0.047 secs away of achieving this rather remarkable feat, in his virginal run in a 248 F1, in Bahrain earlier this year.

Even more remarkable, however, is the way these guys fade, after having run Schumacher so close, initially - although Barrichello always came back strongly over the second half of the season during Michael's championship years, once the title had been sewn up.

One could argue that Rubens was always snapping at Michael's heels in Melbourne's season opener, courtesy of the track's point and squirt nature which concertinas drivers together.

Easy answer

But how does one then explain the Brazilian's performance at Imola in 2002, when he was faster than Schumacher right up to the dying moments of qualifying, before the German commandeered the Brazilian's car to pip him by a mere 0.064 secs.

Oh well, these things happen. That's the easy answer.

But there's a pattern here, with a really interesting little side show as well.

Up to that particular weekend at Imola, see, Barrichello had never driven an F2002 in anger, Schumacher having hogged winter testing of the lone chassis all to himself.

Those were the days, remember, when Ferrari never introduced a car at a fly-away event. Imola or Spain, they argued, was much better positioned to deal with the potential teething problems of a new mount.

So, Imola it also was, where Michael did a lot of F2002 testing while Rubens had to hang around, performing all other kinds of piffling little duties. Yet out of the box Rubens nearly had the upper hand - which really cannot be said for his efforts this year at Honda, against Jenson Button.

The same also goes for Massa, who virtually had to learn his way around the 248 F1's cockpit over the Sakhir GP weekend ?- again after Michael had familiarised himself with the car in pre-season testing, to the exclusion of his team mate.

Now, Schumacher is by no means over the hill.

Best behind him

But it is probably fair to say that he's now at a point where his ultimate best is behind him.

He's got a brighter past than future, so to speak.

And herein fosters and festers Ferrari's problem.

For it's not so much that Michael will be unable to deliver over the next two years (although there are worrying signs that he has been tailing off towards season's end, in 2005 and 2004).

No, King Creole will still deliver. By golly, he might even win the title back this year. Or at least carry the flag proudly.

But he won't carry it for much longer.

Which creates the following dilemma:

Ferrari can't refuse Michael if he would like to sign again.

Yet, in doing so Ferrari might lose Raikkonen forever.

That is to say, if the Kimster gets fed-up by being barred from Maranellian pastures and signs a long-term deal with another team.

A matter of choice

Let there be no doubt about it, however: The Finn fears the German not. He will go to Ferrari, if that's his chosen team.

Schumacher however, will simply not accept Kimi.

Not in this life, nor in any other. He'll block him till kingdom come, or until King Creole goes.

The recent news then, that Raikkonen has "put pen to paper" for Ferrari - announced a day after it became clear that Schumacher is seeking another two-year term - was easy to dispel.

Maranello is not an option for Kimi, simply because Kimi is not an option for Michael. The Schu, after all, is a guy who handpicks his team mates.

Try and picture the following then: Michael and Jean Todt bent over a list of names, trying to figure out who Rubens's replacement should be.

"What about Raikkonen, Michael?" the Toad asks in all innocence, if such a state of purity is at all possible for him. "He's young, fast, hungry and the future."

By golly. After so many years of scouting through the bottom half of the list for a partner, it would have pleased Michael didley squat to stare down the barrel of real speed, real talent and real iron in the soul.

Icy soul?

Or might it be ice in the soul?

It nevertheless begs the question: In what state will he leave Maranello behind?

For if no strong driver is recruited over the next two years, if no future champion is nurtured by the existing elite, the post-Schumacher years might be a little bit rudderless and barren.

Time will tell, of course. But if Kimi and the Scuderia are serious about each other, there is a way past the Schumacher dilemma.

Renault, see, is a force that will not disappear overnight.

But they might disappear in two years' time - just at the moment when Ferrari's old age pensioner's patience is due to run out on Michael Schumacher.

And voila! Two years in a strong car for Kimi, coinciding with an open door at Maranello once Michael moves on to create a F1 team for VW or Audi, or whatever.

Neat, is it not?

Focus on the past

Indeed - unless Ferrari's present focus on the past rather than the future (i.e. retaining Schumacher at the cost of Raikkonen) forces the Flying Finn's hand onto a long-term contract with, well, McLaren.

Or perhaps even Toyota?

The latter is unlikely. The world's second biggest car company might be ready for the Ice Man's massive talent in two year's time, but not right now.

Which again begs the question: Why then, was he sniffing around Cologne?

Briatore certainly wants Raikkonen for Renault - although he has the option of Heikki Kovaleinen as a cheap Kimi imitation to impress cost-minded company boss Carlos Ghosn with.

And McLaren's Martin Whitmarsh, so much less inclined to play hard-ball than team principle Ron Dennis, has made no secret of Woking's desire to retain Raikkonen's services - although Dennis, obviously less than impressed by the Finn's flying flirtation with Ferrari, might already have opened discussions with Rosberg.

Hey, it might save him $20-million a year, vis-à-vis Raikkonen's salary.

Crux of the matter

Here's the crux then: the Kimster's ask is stiff indeed. It has to reflect his stature in the game, after all.

But if it was only money that mattered, the Ice Man would have signed for McLaren a long time ago, probably on a deal similar to Alonso's.

What he's after then, is a title winning car. That's what the waiting is all about, to see which way Michael and Mercedes and McLaren will move.

And it's clever, at least on the face of it, to try to eliminate uncertainties and replace them with certainties.

The problem with F1, however, is the speed at which the game changes.

Somewhere down the line then Raikkonen will have to go out on a limb and make a leap of faith, no matter how well he has researched his options.

Racing is simply too fast a game to wait for anybody. If he's not careful, even Kimi might be passed by.

A McLaren. A Renault. A Ferrari.

And what's left for him, then?

Cologne?
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864242
Lvl 30
It`s going to be a interesting race tomorrow.. Ferrari and Rosberg did not do well in the qualifying.. Button on the pole..
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864243
Lvl 16
Shumi out, Luizzi brings out the 4th safety car session, damn this is a wild one.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864244
Lvl 7
not a bored race, and there are 16 laps left
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864245
Lvl 19
Quite boring race, nothing special. Shame to button, he drove fantasticly on the qualify.

Indeed, shame to button.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864246
Lvl 7
Button... very bad luck, I thought this things only happens to Carlos Sainz at rallys
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864247
Lvl 19
Our commentator Mika Salo just said, if Button had release the switch holding the gearbox, he could roll the car over the finish line. But he obviously didn't release it.

But it was gorgeous firework from 750hp Honda.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864248
Lvl 22
Button got screwed. They really need to do something about the lack of race pace on the honda when the tyres are cold. Its costing Button wins. Anyways, Alonso drove well but he also got lucky again with the the 4 safety cars. And for some reason, Kimi just couldnt catch him

That Renault is like the Ferrari of 2 seasons ago, unbeatable at the minute. But Alonso's good luck has to end sooner or later.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864249
Lvl 19
The hope isn't done yet watty, when the circus arrives to Europe, I have a good feeling the things are going to change, like last year. But this year, the other teams are catching up renault very fast, unlike last year. You remember the speed of Kimi in the Europe, too bad he was loosing the points from the first races.

Alonso really got lucky, the Midlands and BMW between Kimi and he got 3 second pace from the start.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864250
Lvl 22
Yeah youre right mate. Everything seems to just fall into place for Alonso, reminds me so much of Schummie a few seasons back.

Bring on Europe!!!
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864251
Lvl 18
it seems to me there are only 3 world class drivers at the moment.. 1 is getting old (Schumacher) and the other two (Alonso and Kimi) are in a class of their own... they were the only two to lap under 1.26m in Australia... Interesting to note the Ralf Schumacher posted only the 10th fastest lap time yet finished 3rd... Hmmmm...

Juan Pablo Montoya should let Gary Paffet or Pedro dela Rosa drive the 2nd McLaren as he's obviously not metally fit to complete a GP!!! He keeps making simple mistakes that really shouldnt happen to someone earning the kind of money he is... i wonder which team will want him next year...
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864252
Lvl 22
you cant say they are the only world class drivers in the field, not every driver has a mclaren or a renault to drive in.

you stick button, webber etc in either of those cars and they'd be a match for alonso, maybe even kimi.

And Schummie, maybe getting old, but again, his car is letting him down.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864253
Lvl 19
"Kimi Räikkönen is the favourite driver of Niki Lauda and Gerhard Berger".

"Ferrari is willing to pay 5 million dollars to Räikkönen for the year 2007, without driving a Ferrari car! Even if Kimi decides to continue at McLaren next year, Ferrari wants to hold him down for themselves".

Ferrari doesn't want to treat Kimi and Michael as equal teammates, so if Shumacher decides to drive 2007, Kimi gets a nice little waiting-bonus from Ferrari.

So, there aren't any questions who is the most wanted and respected driver in the F1.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864254
Lvl 18
Juan Pablo Montoya has laid into his McLaren team-mate Kimi Raikkonen, accusing the Finn of not only being afraid of him but also of playing games in the Australian Grand Prix.

The conflict between the two McLaren drivers that many had hoped for last season, but which never materialised, finally came into affect in Melbourne on Sunday when both Montoya and Raikkonen refused to give an inch as they tussled for track position at the start of the race.

But while the battle didn't last very long, fans needn't worry because there'll be plenty more to see in the future as the tension levels in the McLaren garage increase.

And as for why that's happening, Montoya claims it's because he's now a threat to Raikkonen's Championship bid.

"Last year I wasn't in a position to fight him so I don't think he felt threatened by me," he told autosport.

The Colombian also slated Raikkonen on-track antics in Melbourne, which saw him set the fastest lap time of the race, a 1:26.045, which was 1.4 seconds faster than Montoya's best. Raikkonen, though, waited until the very last lap of the race before showing his true pace.

"It was Kimi being heroic on the last lap and putting the fastest lap in, because it was half a second quicker than any other lap he did in the race," Montoya said.

"So he was either slow or thinking about something else other than driving except on the last lap.

"If you think about it, how do you go half a second quicker on the last lap? What do you gain out of it?

"It is not going to be a circuit record because the circuit record is 1m24s for Michael (Schumacher), so what are you risking? Going off on the last corner?

"I don't know."
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864255
Lvl 19
Bitter enough? Poor Juan Pablo.

BTW, Kimi said, that they didn't drove as much with his engine as it was planned. So he was trying what he can do with 750hp Mercedes. That was fastest lap of the race. Montoya is just full of shit.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864256
Lvl 18
JP Montoya is delusional... He needs to see a shrink. I think McLaren should have rather kept DC as at least he would have finished the races and not crashed out every time.
Hope to see Alonso and Kimi both driving McLarens next season!!!
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864257
Lvl 19
That is quite funny nowadays. McLaren haven't had 2 great drivers at the same time for ages! First it was Mika Häkkinen who dominate McLaren, and now it's Kimi. It was different in the past days.

Montoya hasn't show anything yet, in Williams he was the same screw-up as nowadays. Spinning at the end of warming lap! That was a fucking classic. Screw-up, indeed.
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
#1864258
Lvl 22
Fucking cant believe Button's luck yet again!!! He was surely up for another top 3 finish. So disappointed for the guy.

Nice to see Renault finally gettign something wrong though. Bad bad decision to bring him in before Schummie... That was so very obvious.

Plus im starting to think that Kimi's head is somewhere else... Ferrari maybe?
* This post has been modified : 19 years ago
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